Friday, June 3, 2005
not impossible...
my mother enjoys sprucing up her yard. which is good because if she didn't the backyard would be fairly bare and the fence would look plain and dull. so every spring she puts in new flowers into her flower bed, new flower boxes on the steel railing and she hangs flower pots from metal hooks screwed into the wooden fence posts. the problem is that the wooden fence posts don't have metal hooks in them. so as i was wandering around this morning at the ungodly hour of 10:30 (yes, that's right i said it, 10:30) my mother has the odacity to ask me if i would be so kind as to screw in these hooks for her. so as any good son would do i took on the task and retrieved the hooks, the screws and screwdriver. that's when it hit me. we don't have a drill and these posts haven't had these hooks in them before. today we're charting new territory. and you know what? its hard starting new holes for screws with only a screwdriver. first you need to find the right position, then you need to balance the screw so it will go in straight while simultaneously applying pressure and twisting...slowly. needless to say the screw fell more than several times. as i was doing all this a quote i had heard on the weekend jumped out at me. i'm not sure exactly why it did but it did. see on saturday i went with my oldest brother john and my best friend nathan to see one of our favourite authors: Brian McLaren. he was speaking at a conference in Waterloo for the day and so we couldn't pass it up. it was something that he said that jumped back into my head as i was screwing these screws in. (now i don't remember word for word what he said, but to paraphrase) he said, "you know what we need is more younger people planting new churches; new postmodern churches" and as i was screwing in these screws i replied back to him (only in my head of course), "yeah but you know what Brian? starting new holes is hard." Brian didn't respond, probably because i was having this conversation with him in my head, but still there was no answer. so i continued, "see Brian you need to find a position and then you need to keep the screw straight and balanced while you simultaneously apply pressure and twist slowly." again, no response (again, probably because it was all in my head). Brian never did say much after that. but from what i know of him, he's a really wise man and if he was actually in that conversation, he would probably respond, "you're right darryl, starting new churches would be hard, but it wouldn't be impossible." and you know what? i believe him. i mean sure they might not have 'cordless drills' for what we want to do and so we have to do it all manually; no church planting kits for the kind of church we're imagining and dreaming of. we'll prolly have to do all the work and it will be hard, but it's not impossible. i mean when i think about it, there aren't that many combinations that build a greater anticipation with in me than NOT IMPOSSIBLE. i think its about time we start some new holes.
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12 comments:
you know at times reading that i sweat i felt those pentecostal holy ghost shivers down my spine into my leg.
a sweaty nathan is a nasty (yet not uncommon) sight.
hope filled thoughts, darryl. the more i think about church planting, the more questions i have...or maybe, the more i drop and re-adjust the screw. what's more is that it seems like the odds are against church planting and church planters at every turn. there are more naysayers than encouragers; more critics than mentors, and on and on the list could go...
either way, obedience to God (or your green thumbed mom) seems the way to go...regardless of inadequate tools and or odd times of day (or life).
by the way, you're a bum. your ass should be out of bed by 9am at the latest.
joe
Oh brother,
You know, to an un-suspecting by-stander watching you talk to yourself could be taken the wrong way.
So I am glad you clarified that you aren’t crazy and that you were talking about starting a revolutionary new “church” and that you were just discussing this with a mentor in whom you have never talked to.
Then again, the unsuspecting person may think you crazier for thinking about changing the church over you having a conversation with yourself.
Either way, I love it. I am so down with what is brewing up with you Tyndale kids. I just have one request. Can you elect me the youngest decan of your church? On second thought, I don’t think you guys will have decans. There over rated.
Peace
Ron
I like this post. Recently I've been having dreams about planting a church with Reformed Distictives with a view to reaching postmodern people (but not a 'postmodern church, whatever that is).
I don't think that's ever been done...especially in light of the fact that McLaren has said that Calvinism is tantamount to modernism itself. I think that it's exciting. In any event we need people who are willing to explain things in a different light. It's exciting that people are getting out there and doing it.
Tom Skerritt
Tom,
I wonder if we could consider this a sort of acid test to the traditions of particular Christian traditions.
Can they engage postmodern people by using resources (intellectual, practical, etc.) internal to their own tradition? Or do they need to borrow from others to prevent themselves from falling on their face?
Perhaps God's judgment on denominational factions might come out through what happens in reaction to postmodernism. Either way, YHWH Malek.
Darryl, Nate and Phil, with all ya'll backgrounds and the Scrap you've gone through, I'm sure the church you become involved in/start will be quite distinctive.
I know this because I know ya'll will make sure there's Ghost.
Though I must say, if it's a cheesy-ass-seeker-sensitive joint, I'll hang my head in shame.
hey guys, thanx for commenting to the post, i really appreciate it.
Tom i love that you want to reach postmoderns its awesome, and people who are lost and among those postmoderns, need people like you who recognize that they are valuable in God's eyes. and they need to be sought after and loved into the Kingdom of God.
what is a postmodern church? well i would say its a church that accomplishes what a church should accomplish but doesn't necessarily do it in the traditional sense. for instance, maybe a postmodern church might not have a 'sunday service' every week. it may have teaching from the Word, and corporate worship, but in a format than an hour and a half slot on a sunday morning. thats just one simple example. but i think the key for us wishing to reach postmoderns is: what is valuable to them, and how do they derive meaning from something? what is important in their eyes? for the answer to those questions will help us demonstrate to them that the Gospel is living and relevant.
but yeah id love to talk more about it with you Tom.
Andrew, bro i love ya.
"Can they engage postmodern people by using resources (intellectual, practical, etc.) internal to their own tradition? Or do they need to borrow from others to prevent themselves from falling on their face?"...
i think you're bang on here. and this is where i think you'll see a huge difference in postmodern christians. i think that most of the time, they will borrow from all different traditions because they realize that no one denomination has it all right. they all have strengths and weaknesses...and i wise Christian will find the strengths in each Christian faction and glean the good out of it.
Enoch...bro. what do you mean, "I know this because I know ya'll will make sure there's Ghost." ???
But Enoch, every church needs to be sensitive to seekers. now that won't be our main focus, but bro, a lot of cheesy-ass-seeker-sensitive churches are doing their part to advance the kingdom.will we end up like one? prolly not. but will we be sensitive to seekers? of course.
so we might not have as much 'Ghost' as you might be hoping, and we might be more sensitive to seekers(or maybe not) than you were hoping. but either way i hope you'll be praying for us instead of hanging youur head in shame.
hey guys, thanx for commenting to the post, i really appreciate it.
Tom i love that you want to reach postmoderns its awesome, and people who are lost and among those postmoderns, need people like you who recognize that they are valuable in God's eyes. and they need to be sought after and loved into the Kingdom of God.
what is a postmodern church? well i would say its a church that accomplishes what a church should accomplish but doesn't necessarily do it in the traditional sense. for instance, maybe a postmodern church might not have a 'sunday service' every week. it may have teaching from the Word, and corporate worship, but in a format than an hour and a half slot on a sunday morning. thats just one simple example. but i think the key for us wishing to reach postmoderns is: what is valuable to them, and how do they derive meaning from something? what is important in their eyes? for the answer to those questions will help us demonstrate to them that the Gospel is living and relevant.
but yeah id love to talk more about it with you Tom.
Andrew, bro i love ya.
"Can they engage postmodern people by using resources (intellectual, practical, etc.) internal to their own tradition? Or do they need to borrow from others to prevent themselves from falling on their face?"...
i think you're bang on here. and this is where i think you'll see a huge difference in postmodern christians. i think that most of the time, they will borrow from all different traditions because they realize that no one denomination has it all right. they all have strengths and weaknesses...and i wise Christian will find the strengths in each Christian faction and glean the good out of it.
Enoch...bro. what do you mean, "I know this because I know ya'll will make sure there's Ghost." ???
But Enoch, every church needs to be sensitive to seekers. now that won't be our main focus, but bro, a lot of cheesy-ass-seeker-sensitive churches are doing their part to advance the kingdom.will we end up like one? prolly not. but will we be sensitive to seekers? of course.
so we might not have as much 'Ghost' as you might be hoping, and we might be more sensitive to seekers(or maybe not) than you were hoping. but either way i hope you'll be praying for us instead of hanging youur head in shame.
Darryl,
Yeah, I pretty much agree. I think for the most part that Christian traditions have flaws in them that need to be complemented by others to be able to confront and engage the post-modern world. In this case we'll probably see the lines of division disappear as we move into this next epoch, as various denominations will start to appear so similar to each other that it will no longer be useful to remain separate.
However, at the same time, it might also legitimately demonstrate to the world that some denominations had more "right" with them than others. Consider, if everyone else on the block begins to have to look like your church to survive, then you might conclude that your church had more right with it to begin with. Obviously we're all sinners, etc. etc. But I think there are degrees of goodness, and I think some denominations have it better off than others.
Regardless, the future is going to be an interesting place.
Give me a fucking break. You imergernt guys are so touchy-feely. It makes me wonder what goes on when you get together for "Tonges ang Laying on of Hands."
I bet you guys like to accept everyone because you still are sexually confused. Douche-Bags.
Berea Bro
Give me a fucking break. You imergernt guys are so touchy-feely. It makes me wonder what goes on when you get together for "Tonges ang Laying on of Hands."
I bet you guys like to accept everyone because you still are sexually confused. Douche-Bags.
Berea Bro
bereabro222@yahoo.ca
dear anonymous.
spelling mistakes are a distraction. please work on it. in your anger you made the following errors.
emergent... not imergernt
tongues... not tonges
and... not ang
and i'm not sure that i would've hyphenated Douche-bags.
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